User talk:Carlos/Archive 7

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Archives: 01020304050607080910


Hi Carlos,

I noticed you created tenebrae (a long needed article!) shortly after I created Category:Tenebrae music as a parent category for T. responsories & Lamentations. Would you mind if I made yours into a redirect?

All the best, Richard Mix 20:32, 14 May 2012 (CDT)

Hi Richard, the reason why I decided to create this new page is because the text on the Category:Tenebrae responsories was becoming too large. As a general wiki rule, we should try to keep category pages as concise as possible, since their main purpose it to be easily navigatable. See for example the pairs Mass & Category:Masses, Requiem & Category:Requiems. I hope it's fine with you. Best regards, —Carlos Email.gif 22:18, 14 May 2012 (CDT)

No problem at all with your change, Carlos. Thanks. Jamesgibb (talk) 16:45, 26 November 2012 (CST)

In principle there's no reason to disagree about avoiding clutter, but as a practical matter Category:Tenebrae music probably will never have more than the two subcategories. But let me ask a technical question instead: how could one list the categorized pages at the top or the middle instead of the bottom? For my own taste, Category:Tenebrae responsories would be much better if one could see the available responsory titles right below a succinct introduction (as at present) , but then be able to look below at a table showing how they fit in without navigating to another page. Another solution might be to list titles in order of services instead of alphabetically, or (more work!) have a hand-maintained list of blue links to text pages... Richard Mix 00:10, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

The short answer for your technical question is no, it's not possible to change the layout of categories; but on the other way around, one can dynamically emulate a category inside regular pages using DPL, as in the examples below:

As a list
category=Tenebrae responsories
As a category
category=Tenebrae responsories

In both examples, the only sorting option available is alphabetically, so if you plan to list titles in order of services, that would have to be done by hand (and updated periodically). —Carlos Email.gif 12:45, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

Ipse est qui post me

I've uploaded the file again and it appears to be OK. Don't know why they didn't come straight to me, though, since my email is available! Jamesgibb 04:05, 23 May 2012 (CDT)

Thanks, James! —Carlos Email.gif 07:23, 23 May 2012 (CDT)

Dr Boyce's gravestones

Hi Carlos! I see you have found my latest additions: the biographical info from Dr Boyce's Essential Cathedral Music. I hope re-formatting the inscriptions is not too much of a pain! Peter Gibson 15:03, 5 June 2012 (CDT)


Hi Carlos. Thanks for that catch using "if" instead of "ifeq" ... I meant to make the change myself but got wrapped up in what I was doing at the time on the "ShowEdition" template (to get it to do the work of the "NewWork" template when displaying on a works page) and didn't return to clean up "IsNew" afterwards!   Chucktalk Giffen 21:07, 10 June 2012 (CDT)

Hi Chuck, no problem! I have just written you on respect of some of the changes you're implementing. Please, let's discuss this further on the Forums. —Carlos Email.gif 21:21, 10 June 2012 (CDT)

Et respicientes - Marenzio

Carlos, I added a version of this today and, while it appears on the works page, it's not being picked up on the main page. The other version there had a broken link. Is that why the system is not picking it up? Jamesgibb 13:30, 12 June 2012 (CDT)

Hi James, Chuck already fixed the problem: the page must be in Category:Sheet_music in order to appear in the Main Page, but the categories had been commented out (deactivated) because the other edition was unavailable. —Carlos Email.gif 15:00, 12 June 2012 (CDT)

A weird redirect

Hi, Carlos! Could you check (and repair, if appropriate) that edit in which the redirection leads to another title/composer? Thanks in advance. Claude 07:10, 26 June 2012 (CDT)

Hi Claude, thanks for alerting me of this, it was indeed wrong. The Redirect fixer was misbehaving some time ago (User talk:Carlos/Archive 3#Redirect fixer?) and was disabled back then, but I imagined it had already been fixed by now. Will see what can be done. —Carlos Email.gif 10:40, 26 June 2012 (CDT)

Miserere mei Domine (Victoria)

Carlos, this page contains versions of two different word settings by Victoria. Three of them are of Miserere mei Domine (Psalm 6:2 and Jeremiah 17:14) and 8234 is of Miserere mei Deus (Psalm 51) I've corrected the text and changed the page to Miserere mei Domine, but splitting out the Psalm 51 version onto a separate page is beyond my level of competence! Jamesgibb 13:50, 26 June 2012 (CDT)

Hi James, good catch! These two works had originally different pages but ended up mixed after an uninformed merger in November 2005. I undeleted the original page for Miserere mei Deus in order to preserve the page history, which would be lost if we created a new page after the split. Regards, —Carlos Email.gif 14:32, 26 June 2012 (CDT)
But a question remains: should the Maundy Thursday category be on the Domine page, on both, or be moved to Deus page? —Carlos Email.gif 14:34, 26 June 2012 (CDT)


Carlos, RE the Bassano - thanks for tidying it up (though you might want to take a look at the Andrea Gabrieli page from which I copied the format, it depends on what you think as to whether publications and collections should be split up). As to the number of parts, it's so typical for Venetian music to list it that I'm keeping it in - see the Gabrieli pages for examples! I feel it makes the music easier to navigate, and in any case the pieces are always listed in Venetian publications by part numbers. For modern precedence, take a look at any Gabrieli Consort recording of the Venetian repertoire: every single title has a part number, ie Buccinate a19, Suscipe a12 etc. Lewis 00:17, 1 July 2012 (CDT)

Gesualdo madrigals

Hello, thanks for your message on the help page. I've just tried to upload a madrigal by Gesualdo, but I find it too difficult to follow the instructions, so I hope it's uploaded okay. I've already typeset about 30 more madrigals, so feel free to give me some guidelines, so that they can soon be uploaded. Also, for some reason I seem to be unable to create pdf files out of the original Sibelius doc., so if anyone could extract the pdf out of it that would be great. Cheers --Chrysalifourfour 10:01, 6 July 2012 (CDT)


Carlos, could you explain how you did that? I tried to remove the extraneous capital letters after I had changed the works page, but it failed to recognise the link. So I changed what was displayed on the Composer page instead. Jamesgibb 01:39, 10 July 2012 (CDT)

Doctor bonus amicus Dei

Carlos, could you explain how you did that? I tried to remove the extraneous capital letters after I had changed the works page, but it failed to recognise the link. So I changed what was displayed on the Composer page instead. (Sorry, I seem to have sent the message twice, rather than editing it!) Jamesgibb 01:40, 10 July 2012 (CDT)

Hi James, there was a comma after bonus in the new title that you overlooked ;) —Carlos Email.gif 10:25, 10 July 2012 (CDT)

Ah. Had I added a comma when I moved the Works page? If so, that explains it. Jamesgibb 11:00, 10 July 2012 (CDT)

Senex puerum portavit

This is a puzzle, Carlos. The Capella file is correct, but the PDF file appears to be the original version when I check it. I've tried deleting all versions of the pdf and reloading it (which appears to have no problem at my end) but I'm still seeing the original file on CPDL when I open it. I'll leave it for a bit and see if the problem has resolved itself. Jamesgibb 02:16, 11 July 2012 (CDT)

Problem seems to be solved now, at least as far as I can see, Carlos. Could you check too, just to be sure? Thanks. Jamesgibb 02:43, 11 July 2012 (CDT)

Alexander Ledkovsky scores

Hi Carlos, the score for Peter & Paul mentions Alexander Ledkovsky as sostavitel' or compiler, rather than composer. I've sung quite a number of his scores, and he tends to mention composers if there are any, including himself. Most of the anonymous settings are taken from the synodal Obihod - unless you have reason to believe this is a different case, of course. On a different note: a number of Ledkovsky's scores are services (actually compilations for vespers, matins and liturgy of the feast) - is there a cat for that? Cordially joachim 08:04, 27 July 2012 (CDT)

Hi Joachim. I'm really not sure yet how to categorize these two works (Service & Hirmosi) with respect to the composer. I also understood from the составитель in the score that he was the editor, but since he cites no other names and was a composer himself, I suspected that either 1) he composed it himself, or 2) he harmonized a traditional Orthodox chant. In both cases it would be acceptable to use his name in the title, although for the latter it was also possible to use (Orthodox chant) (or (Znamenny chant), maybe?) as "composer". But it's just a guess, and the composer may be also (Anonymous). Any hints are appreciated! The anonymous settings from the synodal Obihod that you cite, are they harmonized or just plainchants?
With respect to your second question, sorry but I'm not knowledgeable enough to give you this information, but I'm sure Richard Mix can help with the categorization of these works. Best, —Carlos Email.gif 23:55, 27 July 2012 (CDT)
Hi Carlos. The Obihod usually has 4-part settings - I see no reason to consider Ledkovsky the composer of the anonymous works, even more so since most of them are just traditional settings of the tones. I should think his editions are best left as "Anonymous" unless explicitly mentioned otherwise. I'm not sure all the Obihod melodies are znamenny, but since chant is sort of unison by default, I don't think Ledkovsky's settings should be labelled as such. Regards, Jkelecom (talk) 14:55, 4 August 2012 (CDT)
Thanks for the info, Joachim. I'll rename these two as "Anonymous" then (as well as others in the same situation). Regards, —Carlos Email.gif 15:40, 4 August 2012 (CDT)

Gloria a 16 editions by Sabine Cassola and Bruno Schiffel

Hi Carlos, following your message on my talk page: there is a small logical difference between CPDL #23696 and #24508. CPDL #23696 was submitted as an individual work, while #24508 was submitted as an element of the collection Concerti_1587_(Andrea_and_Giovanni_Gabrieli). When the collection was submitted, I created the collection page Concerti_1587_(Andrea_and_Giovanni_Gabrieli), and I also extracted each item from the collection and created individual work pages for each item (or added a new edition to an existing work page, when applicable). In this specific case, I noticed the presence of a similar edition, however I was not sure 100% that the new edition was identical to the old one. To ensure consistency between this specific individual movement and the whole collection, I preferred to add the new item as an additional edition on the same work page. There is no problem for me if you want to remove #24508, however this may introduce an inconsistency with the collection if the two editions (#23696 and the one inside the collection) are not really identical. Max a.k.a. Choralia 09:58, 30 July 2012 (CDT)

generation of questions


An anonymous person with the user name of Rote has suggested some changes to one of my works. I have tried to communicate with him on his user page but it generates a question for me to answer which I have not been able to work out, so I cannot communicate with him/her. Can you help?

Incidentally thanks for changing the layout of Musica Colonial. It was a definite improvement. Jgoodliffe (talk) 07:26, 4 August 2012 (CDT)

Hi Jonathan, we've just introduced a new Captcha system to avoid spammers, and it still needs some tweaking. We've changed the questions a bit, please try again and see if you succeed this time. And thanks for the compliment! —Carlos Email.gif 13:16, 4 August 2012 (CDT)

Ecce panis (Antonio Lotti)

Carlos, advice please. I've worked out how to create text pages and have done that for a few items with multiple versions. I've added a LinkText to this particular edition, but cannot work out how to add the edition to the relevant text page, since I don't understand the template that produces the columnar form of works using that text. (Ecce panis is an extract from Lauda Sion Salvatorem) Jamesgibb (talk) 11:32, 6 August 2012 (CDT)

Hi James, when the text page displays a dynamic list of works (produced with template TextSettingsList), the corresponding template to be used on the works page is the LnkTxt (instead of LinkText), otherwise the work is not included in the list. For this one I've done the change already. Regards, —Carlos Email.gif 02:19, 7 August 2012 (CDT)

¡Holá Carlos, grácias por tus cordiales saludos de bienvenido! Gregorius Email.gif 9:40, 15 August 2012

Hi, Carlos

Thank you very much for your work! I hope I do things correctly here... I´m quite bad with computers! --Coscas 19:03, 22 August 2012‎

Error in name of composer Gonzales


When creating the page for this composer I put an accent on the E of Geronimo when it should have gone on the first O. I can't correct this. Could you please? His name is given correctly in the score itself. Jonathang (talk) 02:10, 7 September 2012 (CDT)

Done. Claude (talk) 02:23, 7 September 2012 (CDT)
Thanks, Claude! —Carlos Email.gif 19:33, 8 September 2012 (CDT)

Lamentations of Jeremiah page


How do i get the Gonzales setting listed on this page? The list of existing settings refers to "TextSettingsList", but I can't make out how that works.

Jonathang (talk) 06:29, 8 September 2012 (CDT)

Hi Jonathan, everything seems to be correct with the Gonzales setting; sometimes it takes a couple of hours for automated pages to get updated. This may have been the case. The work is now listed on the Lamentations of Jeremiah page. —Carlos Email.gif 19:37, 8 September 2012 (CDT)

Unable to replace file with updated version

Hi Carlos. Sorry to bother you, but can you help me, please? I have been trying to upload a revised version of my pdf file Shep-Inm3.pdf (John Sheppard: In manus tuas, 3rd setting), but the page for the piece persists in displaying the old file. I can't even find the revised file anywhere, even though I have uploaded it about three times.

Jason 03:11, 11 September 2012‎

Hi Jason, is there any noticeable difference between the original and the revised edition for me to check? BTW, to see the files you uploaded, click on the link "my contributions" on top right. Regards, —Carlos Email.gif 01:16, 11 September 2012 (CDT)

Hi Carlos. Thanks for your speedy reply. The only difference is in the notes at the end of the last page, where I have altered the last sentence before the footnote from "This edition has altered..." to "The underlay of the Baritone..."

Hi again, I checked all files uploaded and only the first one was different, all the others being the "new" version. It was certainly just a cache problem, try refreshing the page in your browser if the problem continues today, ok?
On a different subject, please remember to sign your messages by typing four tildes (~~~~) at the end. Regards, —Carlos (talk) 08:42, 11 September 2012 (CDT)

Thank you very much, Carlos. As you say, it does seem to have been a cache issue and now that I have cleared it all seems well. Jason Smart (talk) 10:26, 11 September 2012 (CDT)

Nicolaus Adam Strungk

Hi, yesterday I added Nicolaus Adam Strungk to the composer List (and submitted his Cantata Ich ruf zu die Herr Jesu Christ). It turns out that the composer's death is given at 1750 instead of 1700 in the heading. Could that be corrected please. Noorman (talk) 15:28, 17 September 2012 (CDT)

Just an inattention of mine, sorry. —Carlos (talk) 00:23, 18 September 2012 (CDT)

Hi Carlos, I wonder if my midi-file (19.47 17 Sep Hamm-Fre.mid) went wrong. It should be added to the Andreas Hammerschmidt Cantata: Freuet euch des Herrn. (19.42 17 Sep Hamm-Fre.pdf). The PDF-file came through allright, but I can't see the MIDI-file on CPDL. Could this be checked ? Thanks.

Hi Noorman, the midi file was uploaded correctly, just the link was missing. Is that work for solo Soprano/Tenor or for a choir Soprano/Tenor? —Carlos (talk) 15:14, 18 September 2012 (CDT)

Unintended(?) side-effects of {{Vcat}}


Hi Carlos,

Previously, the Voicing and MultiVoicing templates categorized a works page only in specific voicing catgories SA, SAB, etc. With the change in these templates to use {{Vcat}}, they now also categorize works pages in the collective categories 2-part choral music, 3-part choral music, etc.

Unfortunately, this is not in keeping with the original intent of these latter categories as "container" categories (or super-categories), i.e. categories whose only members are supposed to be categories, and hence contain no Main namespace pages. This explains why the DPL code in 3-part choral music failed, because it was processing and listing not only information from the voicing subcategories but also the large number of pages that appear in that category by virtue of their being put there by {{Vcat}}. You can see the problem when you look at 10-part choral music, where the very same DPL code lists the contents of the various voicing subcagtegories, followed by headers that are the titles of all the pages placed in the category by {{Vcat}}.

I have changed the DPL code for 2-part choral music and 3-part choral music (resstoring in the latter) by adding the selector "namespace=Category" to the DPL code, thus restoring the original functionality of the original code before {{Vcat}}.

If the original intent of the N-part choral music categories is to be retained as container categories, then I think {{Vcat}} needs to be rewritten so as to refrain from categorizing works pages in the N-part choral music categories. On the other hand, if you need the categorization of works pages in N-part choral music categories to make Multi-Category Search work, then a different approach is necessary – such as the addition to the DPL code I made or, perhaps even better(?), placing the voicing categories SA, STB, etc. in different container categories, say, 2-part choral voicings, 3-part choral voicings, etc.

However, I'm not in favor of this latter solution, because the DPL code that I put in several of the N-part choral music categories was placed there at the request of various people, including at least one other admin, who wanted to be able to see, say, 3-part works listed by particular voicings all on 3-part choral music. Perhaps the whole thing needs some rethinking, with a possible solution incorporating the pages in Voicing lists.

Hi Chuck, the inclusion of all works in one of N-part choral music categories was intentional; I explained my intent to Vaarky in a forum post back in 2010 when I first proposed this change (please check this post), sorry if it wasn't clear to you. I particularly don't see any problem in using these categories for both purposes (as 'super-categories' as well as a listing of all N-voice works), but if you believe that a separation is required, I think that it can be achieved more easily by changing only {{vcat}} (instead of moving all voicing subcategories to new ones). I could create categories named simply 'N-part', so that a SATB work would be categorized under SATB and 4-part (or maybe 4 voices?). This would require a relatively simple change to Vcat and to the Multi-category Search. Let me know your decision. —Carlos (talk) 11:58, 25 September 2012 (CDT)

Response from Michael Gray

Thanks Carlos, I'm happy to be here. --MichaelGray 21:21, 1 October 2012‎


Thank you for your good modifications on the page Zoborovski this night! --Rolandou 06:43, 8 November 2012‎



Mick Swithinbank asked me to help him resolve problems when he uploaded some scores. He created a composer page for Canis without realising that one existed already. His new page can be deleted.

You can also delete my edition of "Ta bonne grace" by Canis, as the other one by André Vierendeels, is from an original source and therefore much better. Jonathang (talk) 14:02, 16 November 2012 (CST)

Hello and Thanks

Hi Carlos, thank you for your welcome and for your help bringing my first contributions to cpdl into a correct form! I hope it didn't take too much of your time. I plan to do some more contributions, so please tell me, is it easier for you (and all the other admins and helpers) to correct my contributions, or do you prefer leaving the adding of the wiki codes to the new works and composer pages to you? What is easier for you? Kieldeern (talk) 12:55, 17 November 2012 (CST)

Hello Sigrid, we always encourage users to post editions themselves. The idea behind wikis in general is to profit from a collaborative effort. So please don't be afraid to commit errors, they are easily correctable. Best regards, —Carlos (talk) 15:01, 17 November 2012 (CST)


I've submitted a new chorus-only edition of the Bach Magnificat about two weeks ago. I'm just checking in to see what (if any) progress has been made to including it on CPDL's site. Thanks for any help you can provide. - Ian Loeppky 14:39, 19 November 2012‎

Hi Ian, your edition is now available, thank you! —Carlos (talk) 11:43, 19 November 2012 (CST)

Tama je svud

Hi Carlos, thanks for advise. I made a correction on the work page. IJ.Iva.juras (talk) 10:53, 22 November 2012 (CST)

Wilhelm Peterson-Berger

Helo Carlos

You have helped me before so I contact you again for a little task. There is a Swedish composer named Wilhelm Peterson-Berger. He died 3 of dec 1942. He has written a lot of pieces for mixed choir a capella. I have been working on those for quite some time and would like the composer to be in the composers list 3rd or 4th of dec 2012. You find him on Wikipedia, also the english version. I have 43 pieces of him to upload when the time comes. --Pa.aglert 19:01, 22 November 2012‎

Hi again

I wrote about the swedish composer Wilhelm Peterson-Berger. I fogot to give my name. My user name on CPDL is pa.aglert.

Hi Per-Anders, thanks for your offer to publish your editions of this composer. A page for him has been created as requested. Best regards, —Carlos (talk) 22:39, 22 November 2012 (CST)

Funerary works


Is it worth adding a category for funerary works? I think there is one for burial services, but a wider category may be useful.

On Canis' "Ta bonne grace" I have compromised. Are you happy with this? If one were to include Burney's edition as a standard edition it would be necessary to advise people not to use it. Burney included it in his history as an illustration not as a performing edition. Jonathang (talk) 04:54, 5 December 2012 (CST)

Hi Jonathan, perhaps I'm not the best person to advise you about such categories; Richard Mix has done an extensive work in expanding the categorization of Sacred works, I've asked him to help with this matter.
Regarding Ta bonne grace, I think that was a good compromise! —Carlos (talk) 06:07, 5 December 2012 (CST)
Hi Jonathan, there was some discussion on Category_talk:Laments which led to Sacred laments becoming a super-category of Requiems as well as Burial services, but there's no Secular laments or Elegies yet. Clearly things would benefit from some rethinking! I suggest reopening the older discussion. All the best, Richard Mix (talk) 01:18, 9 December 2012 (CST)